36 Comments
User's avatar
Walter Aske's avatar

Mogg is a huge disappointment, it's like recovering a lost 70s Clint Eastwood thriller, rumoured to have been too racy, too gritty, too fascist for the studio, costarring Gene Hackman, called something like Nazi Cop, but it turns out Clint and Hackman play a homosexual couple who want to adopt a black baby, they fight a bigoted establishment, finally conquering and kissing while you sit there not only having wasted your evening but also now unable to enjoy any Clint Eastwood or Gene Hackman film ever again - that is Mogg.

Spiff's avatar
11hEdited

This sums it up well. I actually believed the Catholic conservative with six kids act. It was a good one. Plausible. Superb cover for the accent and upbringing that may have put others off.

But no. To find out it is really an act is a little disturbing.

I Subscribe To Those I Like's avatar

Well, he is Catholic, so he has to love the browns, the Pope told him so

Jules's avatar
12hEdited

Morgoth, can I ask you a very direct question - probably even a naive one?

Do you think there's any hope, or are we lost?

What are you really working towards/fighting for?

My fear is that pretty much all is lost. And that it has happened so quickly. I've been shocked - almost traumatised - by how quickly our situation has become a) apparent, and b) irreversible. I've had a hunch for 20+ years that something was/is wrong but I was still basically a normie. Now the blinkers have been ripped off and I feel grief at the loss of my homeland. I can't see myself staying and am planning to leave. Sorry for such a blunt question - I'd understand if you ignored it.

Morgoth's avatar

The way I see it, we're heading for a sectarian society of unending conflict. I'm not optimistic.

The question that follows is what to do, and unless we all flee, we need to see ourselves as a tribe and push for our interests.

To zoom out a little, the question haunts me of what to do in the Spenglerian scenario that the West itself is dying, but just like with the immigration situation, it seems to me the most ethical answer is to off-set the harm done.

Jules's avatar
12hEdited

Yes, conflict is now assured. The problem is that 'They' will be able to manage perceptions of it fairly well because of the fractured media landscape.

Yes, your hint that fleeing is basically cowardly is well taken and troubles me too, and I don't think very highly of myself for considering it.

But in the end, we have to have something very core, very deep to fight for and defend. But we haven't - we relinquished our deeper being in the postwar miasma of shopping, comfort, entertainment, hedonism, and allowed ourselves to be deeply culturally and ethically poisoned, compromised and weakened - all by design.

I don't think an ethnos is enough to fight for *in itself* - the ethnos has to become a nation, and the nation needs a transcendent being at its heart, occupying its throne room. For me that is Christ but that locus of aspiration has (disastrously and tragically) long since been collectively jettisoned under the onslaught of relentless anti-Christian propaganda, replaced initially by The Economy....and now, as the ‘economy’ pretext is being killed off, the horrifying face of Power/Control for its own nihilistic sake is now revealing itself as the real motive.

I hate to say it, genuinely, but perhaps such an emasculated, dessicated culture deserves what is coming. Not the people obviously - the wider cultural system. The only people who deserve serious frontier justice here are those who perpetrated this treachery in the first place. But we'll never find them., they’re good at concealing themselves: we'll just be left fighting the other team of victims, thinking they are the real enemy.

Morgoth's avatar

I do think there are limits to media manipulation and clever narrative spin. In fact, I think part of the reason for the rising anger is that the system of containment is failing.

KlarkashTon's avatar

I think the post-war era until the late 90s was very powerful for selling the liberal worldview of the system. Though some few people clearly saw the problems early on (I did not), some perhaps even centuries ago, from a personal standpoint it would have been a hard sell in, say, 1999, to the "young man on the street" that we are heading towards this particular dystopia.

Almost thirty years later we are seeing the veil being lifted much faster than I would have thought possible.

Let us not forget that the people making up the nations of Europe still actually exist in great numbers. The problem has never been one of numbers, but of consciousness and I cannot help but feel that significant advances are being made in that respect.

Spiff's avatar

Alas as the Swedes demonstrated recently, time is against us. We are all facing a hard future even before we become numerical minorities.

Sweden showed the danger already exists when immigrants + progressives + women vote together. The Swedes lurched Right, but just a little too late to counter the triumvirate threat. Only 13 percent were immigrants, but it is enough to change nations forever.

I suspect we will go the same way.

Jules's avatar

Bring it on....

I Subscribe To Those I Like's avatar

If it’s any consolation, I fled, in the late 90s and it doesn’t make things easier. You not only feel home sick, but you have to accept the fact that there’s no home to go back to even if you could. It’s gone, and saying “I told you so” because you could see the signs even back then amount to shite. We have been forsaken. There is no mask anymore, and no where to run to either.

Jules's avatar

Very much agree - and I’m aware of the irony of fleeing your country because you no longer feel it’s home only to go somewhere that definitely isn’t home, and live among people who will have no loyalty to you when the society and economy collapse… There’s no solution for this problem - it will be bleak wherever one goes. That’s what living in times of dissolution feels like…

WeepingWillow's avatar

Well if you want somewhere to go, an an Aussie, you guys are all still welcome here, it’s still a rough approximation of Anglo-in-the-South. You will be accepted as one of us and there is still the kinship bond amongst as old stock Australians and the motherland. We have the same problems that are in some ways worse, but the different is it’s huge here and the urban hellscape escapable, whereas I feel for all of you it’s so small there that everything feels very claustrophobic.

It does sadden me to see the ancestral homeland in such a bad way. When we hear Jerusalem or Scotland the Brave we all still get chills. When I visited Europe the colonial reality hit home to me that perhaps because of insecurity we continue to do things more traditionally than those who stayed home. We still do Victorian and Edwardian rituals like debutant balls and weekend local horse racing.

Large parts of southern Aus also have a very similar climate to the UK.

Jules's avatar

It's very tempting... but pushing 60 I doubt they'd want me. Just medical bills to look forward to, not much tax revenue! :)

WeepingWillow's avatar

Just fake a disability and get on our ridiculous NDIS scheme that is currently being rorted to the hilt by South Asians and middle easterners. We would rather you rort it than them.

Gregory Cray's avatar

Vilfredo Pareto wrote of the political 'sentiments' which drive the actual political action of the day. These pre-rational, emotional states are then rationalised through language post-hoc to sound like they were arrived at through reason, rather than simply being the feelings that they are. This was later scientifically confirmed by Kahneman and his coauthor as 'fast' and 'slow' modes of thought. The core takeaway from this line of thinking is that people rarely arrive at conclusions through thought, and the reasons they say they believe something are rarely the reasons they do.

When you see a faux toff like Mogg holding a variety of contradictory opinions on various subjects, or when you see the normie simultaneously denying the salience of ethnic groups and nations while brandishing the flag of Ukraine, you see what Pareto and Kahneman wrote of. These people aren't really putting forward a 'case' for anything per se; the 'case' is the cover for the actual sentiment driving it. In the case of Mogg, that sentiment is the same as it ever has been for the elite: undiluted selfishness. For the normie, it's cowardice and groupishness.

A core difference between right and left thought is the sense of whether changes in time are simply changes in costume overlaid on the same human substrate, or if the human itself actually changes. As a rightist, it is my view that the elite have always been selfish and power-hungry. If you aren't, you'll find yourself defenestrated from the elite by someone who is. What does change throughout time is the structure of the game, even if the players in it remain unchanged.

A Mogg in ages past would have his interests naturally aligned with the people's to some degree because this country, or its empire, would be the source of his wealth, the place his ancestral home is, the place all his social connections are. He'd be just as selfish, and just as happy to see you die down a coal mine, but when push came to shove and the integrity of the country were threatened, his selfish interests and yours would align: a threat to the nation would be a threat to him. In the international order, none of these constraints remain true. His friends are international elite from the world over. His funds are diversified across every country. If things truly go to hell here, he can just sell that family estate and leave.

The problem for this new international elite, and the international order in general, is it's so transparently obvious that this is the case; that they and we share no aims in common. You can't appeal to the shared aim of defending the homeland when you very transparently have no interest in defending the homeland. You can't simultaneously say nations exist as nothing more than pieces of paper, and you should go die for the integrity of someone else's national borders.

This puts our managerial fox regime in an odd position. Are they eventually going to mass mobilise men by force to fight in the trenches of Donbass? Even they could muster up that level of lion-like action, how would they then deal with the tens of millions of imported pets who not only won't fight, but will represent an absolute majority of the lumpenprole once the natives have been sent off to die? This is yet another case of the revealed madness of the merchant state, the inverted state in which we live. The contradictions continue to mount, and at some point they'll become overdetermined.

Morgoth's avatar

Yes, the contradiction of the supposed impending war I didn't even touch on this piece because I wanted to focus on the Baudrillardian aspects of Mogg in British political life.

Gregory Cray's avatar

Yes, it was well observed. Everything about the inverted, merchant state is very hyperreal, right down to the shape of its elite.

Jules's avatar
12hEdited

Well that's deftly skewered the oily Rees-Mogg. He's only real in his own family and social world. In trying to signal that world on the YT screen as he does, he becomes very fake, a meme, because he doesn't and can't know who he is actually talking to. It's an act. I've never been clear who thinks he's serving on his YT channel - the Tories, or just himself? Probably just himself. Either way I struggle with that horribly complacent drawl - I thought we’d had enough of the greasy, fake-charm Etonian manner since scumbag traitor Johnson and Cameron, but apparently not - Mogg gets hundreds of thousands of views. How stupid so many are: it’s why we’re doomed, actually.

Morgoth's avatar

If he were in earnest, he'd be nowhere near YouTube.

Jules's avatar

Right.

I Subscribe To Those I Like's avatar

Interestingly, his “YouTube career” blossomed during the Boris wave/years. Someone has forgotten to tell him he can pack it in now and just go away

Bushwacked71's avatar

The leader of Luton’s football firm in the 80’s was called Tommy Robinson, that’s where Lennon took the name from.

Terry Bell's avatar

When I was young there was a saying; "what if they held a war & nobody turned up? "

The response to Rees-Moggs little speech the other day shows that people won't be falling for that crap anymore.

My affection to you & all the viewers.

Evola's Sunglasses's avatar

I can't hate “The centre Right” enough. Total traitors.

Hope people give this a SHARE.

Albion's avatar

I remember reading various articles in the early 2000s in which ‘Are-Tommy' was arrested in possession of multiple legal passports + ID under names of Wayne King, Andrew McMasters, Paul Harris + Stephen Lennon. These were issued while he was supposedly on a Right-Wing banned watchlist. With the exception of hints on his Wiki page, the entire thing has been scrubbed off the internet. The MSM only refer to his real name since it came out in his Trial at Leeds Crown Court. Make of that what you will

Spiff's avatar

If you are plastered all over the media, even as a villain, you are a threat to no one. The real threats generally get persona non grata treatment. They are ignored as much as possible.

noogie's avatar

My memory is a bit hazy - but I think in say 2019 he was making a bit of name for himself with some "based" comments. But he outed himself as completely useless when the 2020 covid-shennanigans, I think by just going completely quiet.

Spiff's avatar
11hEdited

He has let the cat out the bag many times since then too. Total fraud. It still shocks me our world is populated by obvious actors. How shallow are these people?

Jack Dobsen's avatar

Not digging for it, but there is little doubt Rees-Mogg somewhere expressed outrage at the Russian suggestion that the Ukrainians are not a distinct people, that they are mongrels, really.

KlarkashTon's avatar

Both of these clowns not only serve a purpose in their cartoonishness when presented to the right-leaning general public as "babyfaces" (with one presumably tailored for consumption by football enthusiasts and the other for enjoyers of Brideshead Revisited), but also for the opposite side of the aisle as equally cartoonish foils and "heels". The accusations of "fascism", of being a "man of the eighteenth century" and all the other ridiculous nonsense creates heat from both crowds. From the system´s point of view: What is not to like?

Xcalibur's avatar

The Progressive Libtard order often vilifies the elites of the past; and to be fair, the European nobility did have their faults. But as you point out here, for all their arrogance and moral lapses, the aristocrats were still allied to the people, and would fight for them, because they were serious about noblesse oblige. I recall reading that the British aristocracy was decimated by WWI because they disproportionately served as officers in that conflict, which in many ways was the beginning of the end for Europe.

Britain is across the pond for me, a rather eccentric place that shares my language, has alot of cultural heritage, but is ultimately of a foreign temperament. I can understand the context there, sort of, but it helps to apply these issues to my own country. Here too, we have illusions drawn in wisps of smoke -- cowboys, patriots, freedom, and the American Dream. But now the Stars & Stripes are replaced by the rainbow fag flag, we live with a mix of degeneracy and bureaucratic tyranny, the American Dream is an unaffordable mirage, and even the Lone Star State is getting ethnically replaced.

Perhaps part of the process of destroying a people is turning them into kitsch, a bunch of stereotyped icons. The Native Americans used to live off the land and buffalo herds, now they're drinking on reservations, their identity reduced to feathered headdresses, teepees, wigwams, tomahawks, and Western movies featuring Sitting Bull or Geronimo. Likewise, Western Whites are reduced to images of the past, like British nobles, swaggering buccaneers, or pioneers out on the frontier, while we rot in the present.

Dumnonia's avatar

I think it's telling that Rees-Mogg entered parliament in 2010, well into the Cameronite project tho Blair-ise the Tory party. Regardless of whether or not his persona is an act is of little consequence. The fact is that the party is an institution based on pretense. It has spent decades gaslighting its voting base into believing that it stands for all the things that Rees-Mogg affects to exude. Yet the reality of their stints in government - not least that of 2010-2024 - has proved that they only seek to join the 'capitalists' in feasting upon the dying corpse of Britain like the vultures that they are.

James Hunt's avatar

Most of the conservatives of the last 20 years are actually Marxists.

Jules's avatar

Funnily enough, perhaps the only person who uses YT in the right way is Malcolm Guite - not fake, not marketing himself as a meme. He resolutely refuses to give airtime to the growing darkness but instead focuses on traditional British culture (Tolkien, the Arthurian cycle, English poetry and culture, and - quietly - Christ and our Christian heritage) and upholds that as a kind of Lamp of Galadriel in the darkness. It’s a great strategy because it constantly reminds us of what we are as a people, what we achieved and why that’s worth fighting for.